ok the time is getting close for me to start a inte cpu pc build up.
in about one month .
what I want is help in finding the best possible products ( make, models )
if you where to build a dream pc single cpu what parts would you buy? no price limit

pc will be used for , top of the line games, audio & video editing . well it will be my main computer & I want power ! but I don't want a problem pc lol so only the best will do

Well 3.06 P4, 1Gb 3500 DDR, SCSI raid yada yada...

no yada yada
I'm looking for brands & models LOL
what I want to do is take everyones input & do a final build up list
then once I build it bench mark it .
This is for real I don't mind spending the money but I want it to be nasty plain & simple..
so really people I would like your input ( people that are in to hardware & know thee stuff please help me out here )
I have a month to reseach all this

So you're going Intel right? Well the 3.06Ghz is in order then. As for memory, Corsair are a very solid brand.

I'm abit out of the loop as regards the latest P4 motherboards so I'll try and find some reviews.

I'm sure someone will suggest a make of SCSI.

Ultimately Slammer though, you will be paying for it all so make sure *you* are happy with it. It's all well and good us recommending stuff but if you should have probs you have to live with it.

hehe yes it's all good
final build list should sort any possible hardware issue . bottom line with the help of other I should be steered in the right direction

Single proc? I laugh at your puny machine.

SCSI RAID is useless in home computers, go for the best 15k drives out at the time, probably some variety of Seagate Cheetah X15s, and a good LSI controller card. Even the 15ks are overkill, better might be to get some Maxtor Atlas 10kIIIs for quite a bit less and use those instead.

Get at least 1GB of ram, I don't worry about brand too much as long as it works. I use Kingston ECC Registered PC2100 in my machine.

There's virtually no performance difference between 7200rpm IDE drives and 10,000rpm or even 15,000rpm SCSI drives. In fact a single IDE drive setup will almost always beat a single SCSI drive. The real benifit of SCSI is it's reliability, uptime, both due to higher manufacturing specs, and it's scalability. Performance is only slightly better then modern IDE drives now, even then you almost need a 64bit PCI controller to see it. It's very hard to justify the enormous cost differences to use SCSI. A nice IDE Raid control (seperate from the MB so you can move your drives to another machine) and a few good 8MB buffered 7200rpm drives is a good price/performance ratio.

Dual CPU's don't make a difference unless you run some pretty intensive applications. The 2nd CPU doesn't kick in until the first is maxed out.... which I've only seen happen a couple times myself, usually during kernel compiles. Even then whatever you are running really needs to be optimized to take advantage of the 2nd CPU. Nowadays CPU's, AMD not Intel, are cheap though....

Im agreeing with what most people are saying here. Though im seriously out of the loop when it comes to Intel, my suggestions would be:

Aluminum Case - hey, its lighter, shiny, and a better heat dissipator.

A bunch of low rpm fans.

At least a 400 watt Power Supply. Enermex is usually good.

Intel 3.06 HT (Hyper-Threading). This is a coin flip between it and a Dual Chip system. Dual based, dont get used fully, as someone has already mentioned, unless the apps have SMP programmed in them, to take advantage of them. In such a case, the HT feature on this chip will help with the load, and save you SOME money compared to a dual based system.

Since your are going DDR, use a Dual Channel DDR based motherboard. Some information/reviews and manufacturers can be found here: http://www6.tomshardware.com/mainboard/02q4/021125/index.html

AT LEAST 512 DDR Corsair or Crucial ram. Im with the others on this, probably a 1 gig to be safe side. Though, arguably PC1066 Rambus would be faster. But its slightly, and not really worth it.

ATI Radeon 9700 Pro (Since the NV30 aka Geforce FX wont be available by then - if it was i'd go for that). Currently i dont believe a second video card is really neccary, as most Pro series has dual montior support in them, and in many cases wont help with the video load in the overall scheme of processing.

Im agreeing with the SCSI performance is negilble compared to a good IDE RAID controller and the WD 8mb Cache drives. If i was you, and not too woried about personal data, i would get a good IDE RAID controller, 64bit, with 4 40gig WD 8mb cache drives, using a RAID 0 stripe only. If you are concerned. You can always have 3 of those drives, and maybe a WD 120gig 8mb cache, running 000+1 stripe. Thats hardcore mind you. You will still notice considerable power with just 2 or 3 WD raid array instead. Serial ATA is on its move as someone has already metioned with ATA150 as a launching point. But it remains to be seen on how much "more" your going to get out of it, vs the IDE array.

If you really want to be nuts, you can get a RAM Drive. These things cost a bloody fortune, 700 U.S. i think with no memory in the card. Then just buy cheap big 4x 512 SDR ram. For a 2 gig at least. This will of course only benefit the app you run that from, and even then, is not possible to use a boot array (aka no using it for windows start up). But if i remember correclty will outperform a Cheetax15 SCSI raid by 4 times the speed i think. Use that for your video editing or 3d rendering stuff only. On games and stuff is practically wasted. It will just load levels faster.

hmm... Im tapped for idea's really. I think HarryB will probably come to the rescue with a list of top notch stuff, as always.

Ditto, I'm sorry, but if you're going to post tech advice try not to be completely full of shit. Modern 15k SCSI will soundly kick the ass of modern IDE both in seek times and sequential reads, not to mention expandability, bandwidth, etc... The ONLY advantages IDE has are the price and the fact that controllers are integrated into most motherboards. Figures from Storagereview.com

Transfer Rates (Drive Start)
Seagate Cheetah 15K.3 (73 GB Ultra320 SCSI) - 76.4 MB/s
Western Digital Caviar WD2000BB (200 GB ATA-100) - 56.5 MB/s

Transfer Rates (Drive End)
Seagate Cheetah 15K.3 (73 GB Ultra320 SCSI) - 51.1 MB/s
Western Digital Caviar WD2000BB (200 GB ATA-100) - 33.1 MB/s

Average Seek
Seagate Cheetah 15K.3 (73 GB Ultra320 SCSI) - 5.9 ms
Western Digital Caviar WD2000JB (200 GB ATA-100) - 14.8 ms

The SCSI drive is almost as fast at the end of the drive as the IDE (fastest currently available) is at the beginning. And of course, the usual anecdotal evidence. My X15-36LPs are faster than any of the IDE drives I've used. Get SCSI if you can afford it. I couldn't, but I got it anyway.

IDE RAID is entirely useless outside of video editing unless you plan on doing RAID 1. RAID 0 is asking for problems.

As for the dual CPU thing, sort of right but not quite. Seperate tasks or threads will be balanced evenly between CPUs, allowing you to do things like rip DVDs and play games at the same time with no slowdown in either application. Since we've got plenty of graphics people here, it wouldn't hurt to mention that it helps a lot in Max & Photoshop as well. If you're only seeing both CPUs being used during recompiles, either you're not running any multithreaded applications, not running more than one program at once, or something is configured wrong on that computer.

Tada.

"dream pc single cpu "

heh, ya lost me there. i wouldn't call a pc a dream pc without dual cpus, but as far as i know there aren't any non xeon dual p4 boards anyway.
here's what i'd suggest:

as for dual cpus: what are you talking about ditto ? one cpu doesn't hit it's maximum load and then the other one takes over, but the load is evenly distributed for the most part. dual cpus improve the overall preformance of windows, however don't get deluted and think you're going to get twice the the speed or double the efficiency (but it does improve it a lot). as said, things like max and photoshop use dual cpus most efficiently but still only between 60-80% from what i've heard. not to mention that you can set programs to use one or the other cpu.
i'd talk about your scsi theories too, but harry already covered that. i take it you don't run dual cpus or scsi ?

as for the pc, i'd agree with most people. basically just check out the parts online before you buy them, because even good names have horrid parts once in a while. i'd also suggest not getting top of the line, unless you want to see the price drop in half in six months and think (why the hell did i buy that for so much), especially with cpus and hds. usually stuff that's a tad older is a lot cheaper and for not that much less.

motherboard : msi, asus or abit - make sure they have good specs with decent upgrade options, usb2.0 support is one thing to look for
ram: 1-2 gigs
hd: seagate scsi or the wd drives with 8 mb of cache
soundcard: creative, if you don't mind dealing with the drivers. i've had tons of problems with creative myself, but they've got a pretty good monopoly.
video: geforce, since i'm still very afraid of ati and won't touch one for a couple of more years.
dvdrom - pioneer
cdrw - plextor, maybe yamaha

Dont the intel 2.6 and above have cooling problems? or have they fixed this now.

and so the opinionated battle begins.

I really dont see the huffle about Raid 0 arrays for IDE. I have 2 systems, one with an onboard raid array, and another with a 64bit raid card. Both run Raid 0 stripped arrays(only), and have been up for almost a year each (well one is like 16 months up straight, the other is just short of a year). Both have been rock solid in performance and speed. But i understand there is alot of flack still from many users. I guess im one of the fortunate few who get to enjoy them in their full glory.

Ok, the dual cpu here is a bit of a problem. Currently (unless someone can correct me on this), there is NO intel based motherboard which does DDR that is a DUAL SOCKET (2 processors) motherboard. Most importantly for the enthusiast is that it must also be a DUAL CHANNEL Memory. Check out some stats on bandwidth for ram:
http://www17.tomshardware.com/cpu/02q4/021114/p4_306ht-09.html
Most PC analysts say that RD ram is dead. Its on its way of being true soon. To get the most out of those dual chips (Xeon 2.8's are the fastest at the moment), you need for the board to be Dual Channel RDram as well 1gig of RDram at PC1200 (heard these get really hot?), you'd be spending $1200 U.S. alone on the ram. (rough estimate).

Currently to take full advantage of a CPU's power you would need/want a Dual Channel based motherboard. More Specifically a DDR based one (DDR-333 or DDR-400 - These things are VERY nice). Right now the only boards that do that are Single Processor boards for Intel. If you wait longer, Dual Channel DDR may make its way to the dual processor boards.

So that kinda leads us back to the P4 3.06 HT processor. This kinda thing is greatly optimized for the video encoding/3d/photoshop stuff then, with the amount of bandwidth these things chug out, they clock nicely with the CPU.

If you are considering Dual processor rig, regardless, Ars Technica did a recent write-up on a "god box". This thing pretty much does the dual processor by the book, with some good suggestions. Worth the read:
http://arstechnica.com/guide/system/godbox.html

Though i think at the end of all this, DS is going to have put his home on another mortgage to afford all that.

I still stand by with my suggestions, if you can afford the SCSI - go for it. But obviously its your moneny. Dual based rig will be largely expensive, more so then even what your willing to pay.

btw - does anyone know if any of the Dual chipset intel motherboards do AGP 8x anyways? If they dont, there goes half your bandwidth if you get a 9700 or Geforce FX.

heh, i was going to post the godbox, my system is loosely based on one when p3s were king.
you've got no argue with me about dual cpus for p4, it's not worth it. i was just saying it has advantages if you had no problem with money. as far as i know, like i said there are no dual non-xeon boards (that cost tons) either. i think i knew they were only using rambus as well, but once i looked at the price of the boards, i didn't look much longer. which is why i'm still stuck with a dual p3 1ghz.

can you explain dual channel memeory for me quick ? sorry i'm out of the loop and exhausted.

basically dual pathway memory efficeny on the motherboard. All older boards run on a single pathway for DDR, the bandwidth was more congested, and not taking full advantage of the extra power available. So, they adapted a technique used originally for older Rambus boards and new Nvidia DDR boards. They make a second pathway, to the memory, in which doubles the latency. Best way i can describe it. For a more technical explaination:
http://www17.tomshardware.com/mainboard/02q4/021125/intel_granitebay-01.html

and i found this interesting. On the previous page to that article it said this:

"On offer: the E7205 Northbridge together with the ICH4 Southbridge (FW82801DB). The latter is familiar from the i845PE/ GE and the i850E. The most important innovation on the E7205 is the dual-channel DDR-SDRAM support for the Pentium 4. What's more, an AGP-8X interface is also incorporated in the chip. This allows for graphic cards like the ATi Radeon 9000 series, ATi FireGL X1, Matrox Parhelia 512 and GeForce4/ Quadro4 AGP8X series to be used. An FSB of 133 MHz ("533 MHz quad-pumped") and hyperthreading are supported by the processor. The E7205 (workstation), bundled with the ICH4, costs $57. "

and

"Unlike the "little" E7205, the E7505 supports Xeon processors with dual configuration. Even 8 GB registered ECC DDR SDRAM can be used on the Tyan S2722 shown in the test. But this comes at a price: Intel sells the E7505 chipset together with the ICH4 for $100. That drives mainboard prices up. "

basically, a dual socket motherboard with these features for DDR dual channel and AGP 8x is possible. But im not familiar with a model yet that does it.

Well this is only my opinions.
From the spec you gave:
Dont go top of the line go midway because as someone else said, in a few months you'll see you paid $200 to $400 more for something only because it just came out.

P4 2.5 Ghz (533Mhz FSB-512K Cache) $269
P4 3.0 Ghz (533Mhz FSB-512K Cache) $699

Koolance Liquid Cooled Tower Case or try some other case options but liquid cooling is the Quietest and gives you the lowest temps. Some options allow cooling of all chips (CPU, Motherboard Chips, Video Card Chip) using the cooling pumps. $150 to $300 range depending on 300w to 550w PS

Corsair XMS3500 DDR 433MHz Cas2 1024 MB $500
Memory cooling kits optional but suggested $20

Video Geforce 4 Ti 4600 128MB DDR AGP Single $230
OR
Quadro4 XGL 900 AGP Dual 128MB DDR $1099

The rest is up to you, so good luck and let us all no what your new box turns out to be.

technically that isnt the quietest and coldest cooling system available. There is always VaporChill and similar based "freezer boxes" to get. But then again, thats just a little bit overboard.

Its VapoChill and the compressors in freezers make a lot of noise after they've worn in...

You're right Shiva, this is due to the overhead of the SMP kernel. Since almost all games are single threaded and rely on being able to have a processor for themselves, background tasks running on the second proc actually slow them down a little. My Dual MP1600+ will regularly get its ass handed to it in framerates by Single XP1600 comps with the same video card, but then that isn't why I bought it.

ouch ok well not look to go so high tech LOL

ok let me break it down abit more
I want the box for gaming, aduio, some video editing not that much video editing.

hummm let me look around a bit & I'll post a starters list then we can take it from there

so far I like these
Creative Labs Audigy 2 Platinum
ATI's All In Wonder 9700 PRO
or gforce4 4600 but I like the ati more
YAMAHA BLACK CRW-F1 CD-RW 44x24x44

Damn amd xp2200 are cheap LOL
but I want intel
someone mentioned overheating
anyone know if they fixed the over heating problems in p4's ?

Can't say I've heard of any probs... nor have I had any with either of mine.

The stock Intel cooler is pretty good, but you should be looking at getting a better one (Swiftech for example).

heat on the p4's are pretty good. its more likely that an AMD processor will overheat vs a intel one. They do get hot, but stock coolers can keep them pretty stable. These things cant really overheat per se. On tomshardware there is a video of "taking the heatsink/fan off a cpu while running". They do it to the P4, the P3, the Thunderbird and the XP. The AMD ones caught on fire. The P3 crashed itself but beyond that no damange. and the P4 kept running, maintaining the lowest temperature. while still playing Quake 3... very slowly.. LOL. The video is about a year old, but intel have been using the same heat dissipationg 'technology' since.

her is my dtream computer
(AT The moment)

P4 3.06
2 GIG RAM
200+ GB HDD
9700 ATI
HEY MAKE IT DUAL PROCCESROR SO ANOTHER P4 3.06
AND LETS ADD A NICE SOUND CARD... NOT MY AREA OF KNOWLEDGE....(OPEN FOR INSULTS)
YES BUNCH OF FANS
GREEN ALUIENWARE CASE
21 INCHER MONITOR
WHO KNOWS MAYBE A DUAL AGP 8X SETUP
DVD BURN
DVD
ZIP DISK
400+ PWOWER SUPPLY
AN DTHAT IS ABOUT IT

BUT SEEIGN HWO MY NEW COMPUER WILL BE 1000 BUCK CANADIAN THIS SETUP WONT BE AVAILABLE AT THAT PRICE ITLL MAYBE BOUT THE YER 2005!

Doughboy:
-technically its not a "alienware" exclusive case. you can buy them anywhere. its a Chieftec Dragon Full Tower. Im too lazy to pull up the model # for it.

-Correct me if im wrong but there is no such thing as a DUAL AGP motherboard. So you cant run Dual AGP 8x cards.

One other thing:

-Text is just as readable with the caps lock off.

actually studies show that text is harder to read if its all in caps. readability is greater with lower caps.

And try placing your text into your email program and spell checking occasionally, it will help you in life to learn how to spell, let alone allow you to receive a higher level of respect and understanding from the members here who have to decipher what you have written.

uhh.. you replied to me, but im just going to assume you mean Doughboy more so than me.

Of course, my mistake. You did however say 'then' rather than 'than' ;o)

bah.. happens. At least its more comprehendible compared to Doughboy.

maybe i sould pull out that typing tutor form thatr box of useless crap ovr there.... or maybe i should loose weight on my fingers so i dotn press six letters at once..... or i could get a new keybpard seeing how trhis one is so unrespionsive

cocky little bastards ehh..

Seriously, if being nice didn't do it, how's this?

I'm going to fucking drive to your house and anally rape you in front of all your friends if you don't start typing properly.

Ok, this thread went from God Box computers, to bad spelling and grammar, to anally raping each other (Somehow, most of the threads end like this, lol).

I've read up a lot on the latest hardware but i can't recall it all off the top of my head, but so that this post isn't useless you can go to www.computerpoweruser.com they have a magazine called cpu, which is great on hardware reviews and stuff

on the vid card -- mebbe wait a bit and get a geforce fx -- may affect your mobo too, if i read correctly, it will be requiring agp x8 -- i THINK

but is supposed to kickass

don't want this thread going to far .
anyone have any other suggestions on mobo's ? keep them coming I should be starting to buy parts after the new year

this is true . lets see how the price is at the begining of the year